voiding warranty

[vegas450r]

Just bought a 07 2500HD. The dealer were I bought it has an accessory dept that deals mostly in aftermarket add ons. they're trying to sell me the Triple Dog diesel downloader. it's made by Bully dog. I asked if it would void the warranty. they say no. cause if anything starts to go wrong , the program shuts down. they said if I had some warranty issues, just put it back to stock configuration, and no one would be the wiser. Can't the dealer tell if the engine performance had been changed when they hook it up for diagonistics. Don't know if I really need this upgrade, as it seems to have all the power I need. I haven't gotten a toy hauler yet, so as far as towing one, don't know how it would perform. The toy hauler i'm looking at is a 26 ft tow behind. I think it's 7k + dry weight.

Any advice would be appreciated.

[Vegas FX400]

i dont have a diesel, but i do have an aftermarket programmer that i use on my truck, and the instructions even say " when you take it in for service , put it back to stock settings"

[barefoot bob]

07 duramax doesnt need any help niether does the ho dodge dont waste your money :freakin_nuts:

[dunefreak]

07 duramax doesnt need any help niether does the ho dodge dont waste your money :freakin_nuts:

this is true....

but to answer your question....here is a true story

General Motors put out a bulletin a while back for 01-06 models. I was working on a 2500HD w/ a Duramax engine that had a hole in the piston and cylinder damage. The engine had to be replaced due to the damage. We are required to call into GM for approval prior to any engine assembly be replaced. When I described the damage, they could tell that the damage was directly a result from an aftermarket add on power programmer. They declined the repairs under warranty and the customer forked out over $11,000 for a new engine.

Here is a small part of the bulletin that deals with this....

...General Motors Position On Aftermarket Power-Up Devices

Important: General Motors does not support or endorse the use of devices or modifications that, when installed, increase the engine horsepower and torque. Refer to bulletin number 04-06-04-054 -- Warranty Admin. - Non-GM Parts and Accessories (Aftermarket).

Important: For further information on aftermarket power-up kits, refer to February 2006 Emerging Issues Course Number 10206.02D. In Canada, information on aftermarket power-up kits will be covered in the April 2006 TAC TALK program.

Aftermarket power-up devices are non-approved by General Motors. These devices are usually piggy-backed in the main engine harness or remain connected to the diagnostic connector to upload the calibration to the ECM. Recent warranty reviews of returned engines show engine breakdown or non-function due to power-up devices that are utilized for increased horsepower and torque. The following information will assist technicians in identifying overpower engine breakdown or non-function due to aftermarket power-up devices vs. non overpower engine breakdown or non-function.

Non-GM parts can alter the design of the vehicle. GM dealers need to be aware of the quality of parts being installed on vehicles. If failure occurs as a result of installation of sub-par parts, warranty coverage may be denied. Refer to Service Bulletin Number 04-06-04-054 Warranty Admin. --Non-GM Parts and Accessories (Aftermarket).

Installed Power-Up Kit

Aftermarket power-up kits have become a very popular add on for performance-minded customers. These devices can add horsepower and torque and can add additional stress to the engine. These aftermarket calibrations take the Duramax™ powertrain outside of its design torque and horsepower rating. They do this by altering air/fuel ratios and injector timing, resulting in excessive cylinder pressure and temperature. When these calibrated parameters are altered, it will upset the design balance and can lead to a reduction of engine life expectancy. Generally, in inspection of Duramax™ engine failure due to power-up failures, two or more cylinders will be affected.

I am not saying that the programmers VOID the warranty all together, but if you have repairs that are needed as a result of damage caused by the prgrammer- GM will not warranty it. You just have to be carefull when adding one.

I myself have a programmer on my truck. No you don't need one, but the extra power is nice. I have an EGT gauge (pyrometer) to moniter exhaust temperatures- very important when adding a tuner to a diesel.

It is true that when you bring it in for service, you should take the programmer off. This way if they have to re-flash (reprogram/ update) the PCM you won't lose your programming.

[SandBox_Kid]

I see that the bulletin is mainly speaking about the Duramax <-----sorry no trademark symbol :freakin_nuts:

However, it is a little misleading when I see the same Diablosport programmer that I have being sold over the counter at the dealership parts counter (Bill Heard)........

Personally I like the results of my programmer. Even on the 87 octane tune the shifting is a little firmer and the performance is noticable. However on the high performance tune and 100 octane.......

[offroadracer]

Like bob said the duramax doesnt need it.. dont waste your money!!...just my .02

[Bound4Dirt]

Like bob said the duramax doesnt need it.. dont waste your money!!...just my .02

I'll 3rd that. The Chevy's (new LBZ) kicks butt.

[Quicksilver]

Don't waste your money. That truck should be more than capable of hauling any toys you have just fine, and then some. I know my Dodge has more power than I will ever need and the new Duramax has more than the Cummins. Have fun and keep your warranty.

[1320]

I know that the big three now g to great lenghts to detect the "boxes" . Some have special classes, some use very unique tricks to detect the addition of a performance box. From a connector seal, to a break away clip etc....thats one reason why I drive a 98 12 valve dodge/cummins. No warrantee for me, but I do have twin compound turbos, three intercoolers, water/meth injection, big injectors, and way over 1100 ft lbs to tow a 50 ft trailer. The d max should be fine with 8000 lbs.

[dunefreak]

I agree with most everyone when they say the LBZ (07 DMax) doesn't need any more power. In my opinion, the LLY programmed is just a tad more peppier than the LBZ stock. Keep it stock and see how it does- I know you'll be happy as it sits.

[AlligatorP]

If you would like a taste of a programmed LBZ, I have a Edge juice in my truck and it works great. I pulled Potesi (sp) at 65, half throttle, juice set on level 2, and the EGT's never peaked 1325. That was right at the top, with my 26FSAK Attitude with 3 quads, full of water, gas and gear. If you want to try the Bully Dog for free, give me a buzz 332-3584 and I can give you the free trial. Or stop by the shop at 4550 Donovan Rd. ste 106 (Craig and I-15)

Chad

[vegas450r]

I appreciate all the great info. Thanks peeps. Now it's time to go looking for that new TH

[OGP]

Just bought a 07 2500HD. The dealer were I bought it has an accessory dept that deals mostly in aftermarket add ons. they're trying to sell me the Triple Dog diesel downloader. it's made by Bully dog. I asked if it would void the warranty. they say no. cause if anything starts to go wrong , the program shuts down. they said if I had some warranty issues, just put it back to stock configuration, and no one would be the wiser. Can't the dealer tell if the engine performance had been changed when they hook it up for diagonistics. Don't know if I really need this upgrade, as it seems to have all the power I need. I haven't gotten a toy hauler yet, so as far as towing one, don't know how it would perform. The toy hauler i'm looking at is a 26 ft tow behind. I think it's 7k + dry weight.

Any advice would be appreciated.

I have an 06 duramax and tow a huge assss 34 ft trail rider toyhauler and have no problems at all. I pull the cajon pass at 65 mph no problem. Dont waste your money and take the chance of hurting your motor for a little extra unneccessary grunt. The duramax will kick the dodges and the fords butts, stock!!

[Richard Cheese]

07 duramax doesnt need any help niether does the ho dodge dont waste your money

what type of programmer was that, pete???

i have the lb7, and run the diablosport predator...set on 65 for everything but towing..towing, i go back to stock

need to install a pyro

pete- did you install that yourself??? the pyro i mean

Edited December 14, 2006 by RICHARDCHEESE

[AlligatorP]

what type of programmer was that, pete???

i have the lb7, and run the diablosport predator...set on 65 for everything but towing..towing, i go back to stock

need to install a pyro

pete- did you install that yourself??? the pyro i mean

Jason,

Installing a Pyro is no big deal. If you need help, I can walk you through it over the phone.

[dunefreak]

what type of programmer was that, pete???

i have the lb7, and run the diablosport predator...set on 65 for everything but towing..towing, i go back to stock

need to install a pyro

pete- did you install that yourself??? the pyro i mean

Not sure what programmer it was on the truck that smoked the motor- it was taken off before it was brought into the dealership.

As for the pyro, I didn't do it myself. But like AlligatorP said- it's not hard. I just didn't have the time to do it myself.

[Richard Cheese]

Jason,

Installing a Pyro is no big deal. If you need help, I can walk you through it over the phone.

chad

is it the hoot method????

drilling the ex manifold doesn't worry me..it is running the wire to the gages through the firewall that has me skidish

[AlligatorP]

chad

is it the hoot method????

drilling the ex manifold doesn't worry me..it is running the wire to the gages through the firewall that has me skidish

Jason

Hoot method is what I use, and there are a couple of easy factory grommets that I run wires through. You have an 03, don't you?

[AlligatorP]

Under the dash, just above the fuse box that you hook the trailer wiring harness into, there is a inch and a half or so rubber grommet that has a small bundel of wires running through it. It has a rubber fitting that pulls out of the hole from the inside of the cab, then you cut the grommet from the engine compartment side and push the wires through. The rubber fitting that you pulled out on the inside slides over the wires you pushed through and then back over the factory ones, push it back up into the hole, and voila`. Then you can start hooking up the ignition wires (I used the SEO ACCY 10 amp fuse in the block in the dash by the drivers door as a tapping location) and then grounded it just below the dash to a factory bolt. For the lights, use the brown and white wire for the dash light dimmer to power and dim the lights.

Edited December 15, 2006 by AlligatorP

[wingnut]

I have an 06 duramax and tow a huge assss 34 ft trail rider toyhauler and have no problems at all. I pull the cajon pass at 65 mph no problem. Dont waste your money and take the chance of hurting your motor for a little extra unneccessary grunt. The duramax will kick the dodges and the fords butts, stock!!

Stop it Pimp, those Bon Bons are getting to your head!!!

[Richard Cheese]

Under the dash, just above the fuse box that you hook the trailer wiring harness into, there is a inch and a half or so rubber grommet that has a small bundel of wires running through it. It has a rubber fitting that pulls out of the hole from the inside of the cab, then you cut the grommet from the engine compartment side and push the wires through. The rubber fitting that you pulled out on the inside slides over the wires you pushed through and then back over the factory ones, push it back up into the hole, and voila`. Then you can start hooking up the ignition wires (I used the SEO ACCY 10 amp fuse in the block in the dash by the drivers door as a tapping location) and then grounded it just below the dash to a factory bolt. For the lights, use the brown and white wire for the dash light dimmer to power and dim the lights.

thanks chad...you running the a pillar gauges??? autometer??

[painterjoe]

A hole in the piston is a good sign of too high EGT's, a perfect example of needing a pyrometer.The LBZ dosen't need a tuner, put your money into the exaust and cold air intake, not that you'll gain much power but it will help lower the EGT's.

[dunefreak]

A hole in the piston is a good sign of too high EGT's, a perfect example of needing a pyrometer.The LBZ dosen't need a tuner, put your money into the exaust and cold air intake, not that you'll gain much power but it will help lower the EGT's.

yep...exactly. :chev_bowtie: :finger_smiley:

[1320]

I run more boost (up to 55 psi) and water injection to keep egts down. I m a dealer for the water injection, and for around town you run methanol and get 50-100 more hp. Water for towing for keeping the egts down.

[painterjoe]

I run more boost (up to 55 psi) and water injection to keep egts down. I m a dealer for the water injection, and for around town you run methanol and get 50-100 more hp. Water for towing for keeping the egts down.

I've heard the methanol can cause detonation, granted it's showing lower egt's but it starts burning pistons. Is there any truth to that?

Also, are you saying you can just run water?

I'm really intrested in water/methanol, but after I heard that I got a little nervous about running it. I know that windshield washer fluid has the right amount of methanol to really not hurt anything but you can't get it in Cali.