dunefreak Posted February 13, 2008 Share Posted February 13, 2008 I have put together a better visible map of the areas that are "out of bounds" along with a page explaining the importance of staying out of these areas. http://www.dumontduneriders.com/closure_threat.html For anyone displaying this banner in their sig, ...it would be effective to link it to that page as well. . Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wsky70 Posted February 13, 2008 Share Posted February 13, 2008 Hey Pete, I could use a little help linking and posting that banner if you could...... :shocked2: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dunefreak Posted February 13, 2008 Share Posted February 13, 2008 Hey Pete, I could use a little help linking and posting that banner if you could...... :shocked2: Not a problem. Just copy and paste this whole code into your signature. (Go to "my controls", edit signature, then paste the code...) [url=http://www.dumontduneriders.com/closure_threat.html][img=http://www.dumontduneriders.com/images/closure-sign_thumb.jpg][/url] Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wsky70 Posted February 13, 2008 Share Posted February 13, 2008 (edited) Thanks Brother Man..... I'm also gonna try to ride the boundry this weekend and get GPS coords for it, might help us out a little more with a map thing :shocked2: Edited February 13, 2008 by wsky70 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheAlaskan Posted February 13, 2008 Share Posted February 13, 2008 Thanks Brother Man..... I'm also gonna try to ride the boundry this weekend and get GPS coords for it, might help us out a little more with a map thing :shocked2: thats a damn good idea.....even though i dont have GPS, just looking at a map of the boundries out there to see where they are would be very helpfull Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wsky70 Posted February 13, 2008 Share Posted February 13, 2008 thats a damn good idea.....even though i dont have GPS, just looking at a map of the boundries out there to see where they are would be very helpfull Ian, click on that link and Pete has a map up to get a look at the boundry line....SF Woody :shocked2: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheAlaskan Posted February 13, 2008 Share Posted February 13, 2008 Ian, click on that link and Pete has a map up to get a look at the boundry line....SF Woody :shocked2: ahhh nice.....good to know I've been staying in the open area since I dont think I've ever seen a boundry marker out there. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EY3BA11 Posted February 13, 2008 Share Posted February 13, 2008 i have seen boundry markers on the north side of the dunes.. i havent wandered around the south end to much to find the carsonite markers around the mountains though Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
v8rail Posted February 17, 2008 Share Posted February 17, 2008 Basically someone needs to survey all the areas around dumont dunes for lizards. I have a feeling that although they are rare where the heaviest ORV activity occurs, they might be dirt common and in no danger at all just a mile away. Umaguy, I think thats exactly the point WE have to make. where most OHV activity occurs is in the big sand hills => no vegitation => No prime habitat for the lizzard. but look at this picture : a little difficult to see, but bellow the dark brown mountain are the Val Jean dunes. I made the picture standing on the defunct TT railroad grade looking west. Btw the rr grade is the west border of the OHV area. So all you see in the picture is wilderness area ... and as you can see a lot of OHV traffic there NOT When you walk into the wilderness you will see hundreds of Lizzards : sandy ground => overgrown => prime habitat for the Lizzard. To the guys that gave you a hard time ... WE need to show John Q Public the truth and that is not made very well with personal attacs. Umaguy is not our enemy, when you guys want to see and read about our enemy, visit this interesting link Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eli Posted July 1, 2008 Share Posted July 1, 2008 Sounds like pretty good news for us for now correct? Does this mean Dumont is off the hook unless they find that the lizard is a “distinct population" over the next 12 months of research? That's what I got out of it at least. Not exactly.....they will be more than happy to ban OHV use in an area while they "study!" As far as GPSing the bountry. It's not that simple. The Desert Protection Act which started all this was defined with LARGE, THICK magic markers on large scale maps. The BLM doesn't know EXACTLY where the boundries are and neither does anybody else. When defined by words like "50' EAST of the Tonopah & Tidewater railroad grade" the BLM either ignores them or has found another reason to close areas WEST of the grade. Seen any closed signs WEST of the grade around Dumont? This isn't about any animal or staying within the boundries. This is about the Amaragosa River and Sperry Wash. The greenies know that. Apparently most duners don't. If there is an endangered critter that lives in, eats plants by or heads toward the river because that's where the water is or simply declare it a scenic river.......and all the crossings will be closed. INCLUDING THE ONE YOU USE TO GET TO THE DUNES I don't see any of those user fees being used to build a bridge. Eli Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eli Posted July 1, 2008 Share Posted July 1, 2008 I don't see any of those user fees being used to build a bridge. But then that would require many more years of critter study trying to find an endangered one. Eli Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
beau Posted July 1, 2008 Share Posted July 1, 2008 (edited) There is currently a bill in the works by Congressman Buck McKeon and Senator Boxer that includes the Armagosa River and its Wild and Scenic designations. Although I believe the Armagosa River part of the bill is a great thing for the duners but this bill is being fought vigorously by the AAPL group and a majority of the residents in the primary area affected, the Northern Inyo County and Mono County areas. Just for info I am extremely against this bill in its current form, a large majority of the proposed "wilderness" areas in no way fall under the definition of Wilderness per the Wilderness Act. This bill will essentially lock the gate as far as access to the mountains to anyone who can't walk there on their own two feet. Although they are "cherry stemming" roads into the maps history has shown that once the bill passes the roads are closed shortly thereafter citing people not sticking to the roads. Here is a link to the bill Wilderness Bill Edit== I should add that per the maps the Armagosa River section from Tecopa through the dunes including all of Sperry Wash is to be designated Recreational use. Edited July 1, 2008 by beau Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
barefoot bob Posted July 1, 2008 Share Posted July 1, 2008 (edited) i read every inch of this and after sifting through the bla bla bla a couple of questions arise. a) i agree we shouldnt attack uma i would like to know how the greenies think. B) how do you take a scientific study on a species to decide wheather or not there becoming extinct. if there has never been a study made?? how do you compare there population to 20 years ago when theres was nothing ever done ?? guess ?? not exactly scientific. c) why isnt there a study that the orv presence helps them by warding off predators. D) what was the basis of bringing up a study on them now ?? what science was used to raise eyebrows that they are in any way endangered ??? e) one gene is slightly different so that is scientific cause to log them as a species unto themselves ?? they havn't seen other lizards for a half a million years so we assume they must be different ??? how did they conclude this ?? how can they claim any of this i havnt seen one person refer us to a scientific study on these lizards. which leads into how do we know there native to america ??? has there been any distinct dna testing ?? f) why is there an inference that tax payer money should be spent studying this?? what is the enviromentle impact if they did dissapear from dumont area ??? g) i dont see a rash of dead lizards anywhere in the dumont area. is there a sudden high mortality rate ?? if so how did they determine this ??? h) has anyone transplanted them and studied if they could survive in a different area such as currently closed areas like kelso dunes ?? i) could it be possable to petition the government and the states to stop closing lands without just cause and petition to have such a government study groupe formed to insure no more frivolous half truthed petitions no longer affect us. or possably a petition to our government officials to stop closing our lands ?? imo it seems like conjecture, no facts, a lil guess work, no scientific studies. this lizard is no where near applicable to an endangered species as was the milkvetch not applicable. I think we would be light years ahead of these debates, if corva and other groupes actually went back through the greenies petitions they took to court. uncovered the half truths. sued them for wasting tax dollars by perjuring themselves and discredit them. so they can be seen for who they are. there lying and cheating to get there way. the blm and other agencies that constantly put up with frivolous attacks and are forced to take them seriously should have an attorney led group to challenge findings of these people untill it shown beyond reasonable doubt a problem exists. before denying us our right to public lands. why should this be taken seriuosly by our government when there is no proof positive ??? and create a threat to our way of life ?? there is more malice twords off roaders shown here by the greenies than actuall concern for a lizard whom we have no idea it has a problem ........................................... Edited July 1, 2008 by barefoot bob Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eli Posted July 2, 2008 Share Posted July 2, 2008 D) what was the basis of bringing up a study on them now ?? what science was used to raise eyebrows that they are in any way endangered ??? IMHO they just want to study a lizard because they haven't managed to get the Amaragosa Vole (a sort of rat) declared endangered.....yet. Eli Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kitcat Posted July 2, 2008 Share Posted July 2, 2008 I saw this on the bill: ACCESS TO PRIVATE PROPERTY.—The Secretary concerned shall provide any owner of private property within the boundary of a wilderness area designated by this Act adequate access to the property to ensure the reasonable use and enjoyment of the property by the owner. WTF - reasonable use of your own land? What is this - Russia??? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
beau Posted July 2, 2008 Share Posted July 2, 2008 I saw this on the bill: ACCESS TO PRIVATE PROPERTY.—The Secretary concerned shall provide any owner of private property within the boundary of a wilderness area designated by this Act adequate access to the property to ensure the reasonable use and enjoyment of the property by the owner. WTF - reasonable use of your own land? What is this - Russia??? And the Sierra Clubber's wonder why people are so against this bill... That's the sad part. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
barefoot bob Posted July 3, 2008 Share Posted July 3, 2008 what falls along those same lines is people selling there mineral rights for mining and such on government property. my buddy almost fell for this. you buy the rights for about 10 grand you think you can post up a small mining claim. and use the property, and when you check the gov will simply say yes he owns the mineral rights ect. but if you dig deeper ( usually after you have purchased) you find another dept of the agencey that will tell you you can only access your mineral rights in gov area that is not protected. and if the whole property is protected you cant touch or even drive on the property. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
desertskyz Posted November 20, 2008 Share Posted November 20, 2008 I am not sure how this is going to impact our situation. I really don't understand it all that well either. I'm not a politician. I think is wrong a alot of levels. Like opening up drilling in Utah. I don't know, maybe it a good thing. The part where they say getting rid the independent biologist review is bad. http://www.google.com/hostednews/ap/articl...vcmx4gD94ICH781 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Richard Cheese Posted November 20, 2008 Share Posted November 20, 2008 usually, the independent biologists arent very independent. however...the guy from fullerton that did the lizard study is unbiased, imo...and is an ally to us duners Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Richard Cheese Posted November 20, 2008 Share Posted November 20, 2008 usually, the independent biologists arent very independent. however...the guy from fullerton that did the lizard study is unbiased, imo...and is an ally to us duners Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Join the conversation
You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.